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Edzll

Blown New Advent driver

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27 minutes ago, Edzll said:

Would there be any danger in connecting both of the amp's R&L speaker outputs together, going to one speaker ''set' (i.e. tweet & woof)? Kind of effectively mono delivered to one side.

 

It would be much easier to switch the amp to mono and turn the balance control fully to the good speaker.

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9 minutes ago, Aadams said:

It would be much easier to switch the amp to mono and turn the balance control fully to the good speaker.

Looking for that switch ........

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51 minutes ago, Aadams said:

Would there be any danger in connecting both of the amp's R&L speaker outputs together, going to one speaker ''set' (i.e. tweet & woof)? Kind of effectively mono delivered to one side.

I don't think anyone on this forum will advise you to combine those wires.  My advice is to get another driver or have yours repaired. 

Adams

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Edzill  I just may have your woofer.  Last July I attended the midwest audiofest in Springboro OH. As I was leaving one of the exhibitors there made me a deal on these two pairs of Original Large Advents. The cabinets were in excellent shape even though seven of the eight drivers were incorrect. 

FwSOCCpl.jpg

Three of the woofers were 12 in Radio Shack models and one a Jensen era 10 in woofer, which I believe is the one used in your 5012 speaker. The Jensen woofer has a round magnet as compared to the New Large Advents square magnet woofer from the pre International Jensen takeover.

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oBa2z6Bl.jpg

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Others are welcome to jump in and confirm if this is the right part, but I am sure it is. Personal message me if you are interested. I have the correct Rick Cobb supplied surround and can install it this weekend. Oh yea, I noticed that your damaged woofer has the surround installed incorrectly. I doubt it matters much, just like to do it like Henry wanted it.

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larrybody; great thanks for your message. The front and dimensions of your woofer look exactly right. Personally I don't know if the different magnet is a significant issue in terms of compatibility of the two woofers - mine being square & flat where yours is round & domed. Lacking specific/technical knowledge I'm quite unsure. Same is true about the 4.5 reading on your meter. I welcome your coments on this and those of any knowledgeable others who'd like to "jump in."

If you want to talk about price, shipping costs to B.C. etc would you prefer using private messages?

If you care to enlighten me (and others watching) about correct/incorrect foam installation, (or anything else :)) by all means do.

Alexander (Edzll)

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16 hours ago, JKent said:

Alexander,

If you decide to go the repair route as opposed to buying a new or used replacement, the universally-acknowledged woofer repair guru is Bill LeGall. He's also a very good guy. He will be happy to give you a repair estimate:

http://www.millersound.net/index.html

Absolutely, +1 and then some

He has repaired ancient field coil drivers for me that others wouldn't even talk to me about let alone repair

His work is pristine AND immaculate

Craig

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15 hours ago, Edzll said:

Thanks A(a)dams. By now, mostly thanks to yourself, I've got a pretty good feel for which advertised drivers are the one I need, which ones are definitely not, and which ones I need more info about. - including front & rear photos, preferably  with illustrated front measurements.

I'm getting advice from several folks now - thanks all - so I'll just mostly address myself to the forum; maybe repeating a few things I said before that have been skipped over :). The driver in question makes horrid rattling noises on loud low-frequencies after being accidentally subjected to a burst of ear-shattering noise. If I push on the cone it makes a scraping noise.

I'm on Vancouver Island so US postage & dollar premium - ours is $0.80 - could be an issue in pricing repairs/replacement. Closest repair guy I can find online is in Victoria; about 3 hr drive south so not too bad but I don't know beans about him. I won't consider 'D.I.M.yself' speaker repairs.

I've still been using both speakers at modest volume with no audible distortion but I'd guess Adams may be right in saying I could be doing further damage . I guess I'll disconnect the bad one. Would there be any danger in connecting both of the amp's R&L speaker outputs together, going to one speaker ''set' (i.e. tweet & woof)? Kind of effectively mono delivered to one side.'

You certainly aren't the first Canadian I've encountered to cry about y'all's costs of doing things, with all due respect

You live where you live and it "is what it is"

I understand and fully appreciate all of that and we all aren't made of money, myself included,, but there is also the important thing to remember

Measure twice and cut once

I would strongly urge you to take Kent's advice (and mine) and suck it up and have both of your woofers done by Bill

You'll know what you've got and they'll be better than they ever were

(and you'll never have to give them a second thought again)

Don't be penny wise and pound foolish

And for the record, I have NO financial interest or affiliation with Bill LeGall beyond being an EXTREMELY satisfied customer (and I do much of my own work as well - I just know enough to know what I don't know)

After Bill does his thing, your drivers will be better than they were the day they were born - that's a FACT

Sincerely

Craig

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Hey Alex   My bad for not reading the thread completely and missing that your woofer has the square magnet. I guess I was assuming that all 50XX series Advents used these Jensen sourced woofers. In reality the 5002/5012 was released in 1985 and International Jensen did not take over till 1989. Production continued until sometime in the early 90's. Your speakers probably say Cambridge MA and not Schiller Park IL. Do yours have the fuse? 

uT6SRjPl.jpg

 

I have two of the square magnet woofers in reserve for my New Large Advents or for a upcoming project.

Ar09zYRm.jpgK48Mpgom.jpgMyvqkJHm.jpg

 

I don't know if there are any sonic differences between the two woofers. I weighed them and the square magnet woofer is about 1/2 pound heaver. 

kevNetVl.jpg 

 

There is a square magnet woofer listed today on the auction site in Vancouver and is reasonably priced. If I were you I would replace it with a like woofer or have yours repaired by Millersound. 

LarryinIN

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Mine have the fuse and say Cambridge MA. Labelled 5012/0 with serial nos xo 016191 & 016219. Did I mention how pretty they are?5a8ef3ea3d546_Adventspeakercropped.thumb.jpg.b559269208ee782d94f8a1c563794dba.jpg

I've messaged you about  the Vancouver driver  for sale.

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I've disconnected the damaged speaker and am listening to 'half stereo' on the other side. It's surprisingly listenable. I may have located a good repair tech here on the island but can't meet him till sometime in March. He'll be in my area & hopefully can see/hear the speaker in situ.

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On 22/02/2018 at 6:34 AM, Analogman said:

You certainly aren't the first Canadian I've encountered to cry about y'all's costs of doing things, with all due respect

You live where you live and it "is what it is"

I understand and fully appreciate all of that and we all aren't made of money, myself included,, but there is also the important thing to remember

Measure twice and cut once

I would strongly urge you to take Kent's advice (and mine) and suck it up and have both of your woofers done by Bill

You'll know what you've got and they'll be better than they ever were

(and you'll never have to give them a second thought again)

Don't be penny wise and pound foolish

And for the record, I have NO financial interest or affiliation with Bill LeGall beyond being an EXTREMELY satisfied customer (and I do much of my own work as well - I just know enough to know what I don't know)

After Bill does his thing, your drivers will be better than they were the day they were born - that's a FACT

Sincerely

Craig

Craig and Kent "please note":

From the Millersound website: "PLEASE NOTE: We do not provide service outside the United States. "

 

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2 minutes ago, Edzll said:

Craig and Kent "please note":

From the Millersound website: "PLEASE NOTE: We do not provide service outside the United States. "

oooops! Sorry to give bad (or unusable) advice :(

Well, there's always ebay.......

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28 minutes ago, JKent said:

oooops! Sorry to give bad (or unusable) advice :(

Well, there's always ebay.......

No sweat; well meant I'm sure. Ebay seems scary - won't know what you've really bought till you get it & test it, and even if it's returnable that' would be a hassle. For now I'll concentrate on seeking competent repair people closer to home. Meantime my son, 2 hours south of me, is suggesting that once I get my set back in working order we should do a stacked experiment at his place with my oak set on top of his walnuts (he got them same time as mine but to match the waterbed frame he'd built for his basement hideaway). I've been teasing him that once I'm gone he'll be sorry he didn't get an oak set - they won't match!

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I've known Bill a long time and I guarantee you he'd be able to handle a Canadian transaction

Pick up the phone and give the man a call

And whether he does (decide to help you) or he doesn't, all you are doing now (and everything else at this point) is wasting time

Craig

P.S.: Plus, let me give you a little tip - Bill is NOT a fan of email - CALL HIM

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On 2/26/2018 at 10:43 AM, Edzll said:

 

Don't know exactly how to interpret this post and don't really care

Just hope it wasn't negative in nature as I was just passing along some sound (no pun intended) advice is dealing with one of probably the top 5 speaker repair men, or just speaker men period, in the good old U.S.A.  KNOWN QUANTITY and guaranteed PRISTINE results

Just telling you what I know from actual experience in dealing with the man and a long time relationship

And for what it's worth, few people are as gracious as Bill LeGall, but suffice it to say, he prefers (as do I) doing business in the analog domain (i.e.: face to face, voice to voice and with a Human connection)  The punks today call it "old school"

Take it for what you will brother

Good luck getting your speakers repaired

Craig

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Early versions of the Jensen 5002/12 used the Advent made NLA woofer which has the all steel

frame, fabric looking dust cap, and a square magnet.  I'd guess that when they ran out they built

their own woofer, from the front the only difference is that the dust cap is paper.  From the back

it is obvious because they have a round magnet and a bumped back plate.  The motor design is

somewhat different but the cone and in general they seem to be the same.

I'd either get two new round magnet woofers, or get what most people would call a New Large

Advent woofer since it looks like that is what you already have.

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I just looked on ebay and found a Jensen woofer (round magnet) with a fabric dust cap,

seems that there are many combinations of parts.

Round magnet with a Jensen part number seems to be the definitive way to check.

All OLA and NLA woofers that I've ever seen had square magnets.

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The shape of the magnet makes absolutely no difference

The power of the magnet does

The speakers up for discussion are a Jensen Electronics era product and that 10" cone and motor are as common as dirt (which most of you already know I am sure)

The flange mounting is simply a cosmetic nod to the "real" Advents built by Henry and does prove to be a pain to source currently

Find a pair of new Jensen Electronics 10"s (from or for any of the multitude of their "Advent" 2-ways) and bolt them in, that or simply re-cone them (parts are readily available for that)

"Legacy" "Legacy II" etc etc etc

This is not a complicated problem - not the same as restoring a pair of "real" once built by Henry Kloss Advents

Not trying to sound ugly, but you can probably buy another pair of any of the dozen "versions" of the 10" two ways Jensen Electronics churned out during the late '80s through the '90s for less than having yours properly repaired and still have the same speakers (read: paying someone else to fix them for you)

With the exception of the VERY first models sold in '81 - '82 post bankruptcy time, none of these systems have anything to do with Henry Kloss' ADVENTs except in name/some cosmetics only (and marketing inspiration)

I wouldn't make a big deal, jump through hoops, spend a lot of money or fret too much on any level over keeping them "original" - fitment of any of those 10"s with the same nominal impedance rating and they'll sound the same, perfectly fine

Craig

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Thanks Craig. Although I greatly enjoy high quality reproduction of good music, I'm (obviously) not a sound engineer/hobbyist, an Advent historian or even a real audiophile . Many of the forum technical/historical comments go right past me. When you mention "new Jensen Electronics 10"s" I guess you're not talking about literally new drivers?

I'm not concerned with cosmetic or brand-name authenticity, only that I finish up with an acoustically matched pair of woofers that will be easily mounted & connected in my existing cabinets and deliver sound quality as good as the original set.

In my area nothing Advent is "common as dirt," or common at all if you can even find anything. I was hoping to avoid buying something unseen, at a distance; potentially unsatisfactory and with attendant shipping & handling costs. But maybe, ultimately, that's my best(!) option.

Meantime the repair guy I had in mind has been hard to nail down and I've been stuck with monaural entertainment. Hey, that's what I grew up with! :) - on a wind-up "gramophone" with steel needles. And with trips to the post office - they had a generator - to have our "accumulator" charged up so we could hear on the radio how (officially) the war was going.

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What is the diameter of the woofer's hole?

Everyone selling new (the pin cushion style frame like yours) at reasonable prices are sold out 

These may work, if not there are other to check out as possible candidates

All you need to be concerned with is nominal impedance and hole diameter - the one below would be a good match if your cabinet allows - well reviewed to boot:

https://www.parts-express.com/grs-10pf-8-10-paper-cone-foam-surround-woofer--292-410

The one above is the same woofer this joker is selling for more than twice as much and he's sold over 700 of them:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-10-Woofer-Speaker-Home-Audio-8ohm-bass-replacement-sound-220w-10inch-stereo/181090495264?hash=item2a29d5ab20:g:dt8AAOSw9r1WCGsg

All the affordable 10"s:

https://www.parts-express.com/cat/woofers/15?N=19809+4294967118+4294965083&Ne=10166&Nrs=collection()%2Frecord[endeca%3Amatches(.%2C"P_PortalID"%2C"1")+and+endeca%3Amatches(.%2C"P_Searchable"%2C"1")]&PortalID=1

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Do NOT substitute for the original woofer which was an excellent design.

Get another square or round magnet original type, if you go with a round magnet it would be

better but not required to get two.

A square one WILL come up on ebay, wait and you WILL fine one.

Analogman is giving you bad advice.

A Jensen Advent Legacy woofer will drop right though the hole for an NLA woofer,  I have a

Legacy woofer in my hand and just tried it.

I am the author of this web page and the early and late 5002/5012 are mentioned:

http://baselaudiolab.com/ADVENT_LA_XO.html

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