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Spade terminal


DavidDru

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Following another posters link to parts express related to binding posts I came across this newer spade type connection that I thought I would make sure you all know was available. looks good. Might make some of you happy( if you don't mind the price) I'm gonna get me some. Those AR posts drive me nuts. Don't know how many times I have panicked thinking I had a channel out or something in my amp...

http://www.parts-express.com/5-16-spade-terminal-with-dual-set-screws-and-poly-carbonate-shell-2-pair--091-3606

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10-7-14

David man, man David, spades that long can be a problem as I have learned because the curved cut-out in the typical AR speaker probably won’t allow such a long-bodied type of spade.

My experience is to use a regular, short spade, depending on the gauge wire you want to use and the diameter of the post it will be mounted on.

24 years ago in 1990, I was using 10 AWG on my LST’s and used a standard typical gold-plated short spade, not like the fancy ones you mentioned. There are some outrageously priced spades out there but, my feeling is standard and common ones will work as good as any, and the rest are simply pretty or snake-oil and marketing, although some can have a better grip I presume, but are not absolutely necessary. Cleaning the contact area and using some contact enhancer like D5 is a good thing too.

In my latest LST set-up I decided to use the 12AWG generic P.E. speaker cable and elected to use the rat-shack standard, allegedly gold plated spade that accommodates up to 12 gauge wire, it was part #278-311A.

There might be a problem finding them as I feel these days that store isn’t really about radio or Hi-Fi any longer, not really since before the mid 1980s. In fact I have two of those stores about 20 minutes away and I bought out their stock of dusty packages. I get the feeling I won’t see them carry these any longer as that chain of stores is really all about radio-controlled plastic toy cars, cell phones and the like, with a minimum emphases on hi-fi gear if at all.

I think for that chain, those days are over?

I have also learned that when you use these type of spades it’s best not to solder them, as it doesn’t really help make a better connection.

So, I made a super tight crimp on each one and made sure they held tight with out using any solder.

If you choose to solder, usually it will not permit the rubber sleeve that goes over it to fit correctly and will melt the cable’s sheath making for a messy and sloppy looking job.

Gee, I feel somewhat out of character here talking so, well, properly and seriously instead of my usual ranting, verbose and silly diatribe.

But, I refuse to be serious this late in life so let me say this; how come no one responded or posted any comment at all about the awful foto I posted of my system? Was the room too messy and cluttered to speak of or comment on?

I’d like to see other member’s systems myself and maybe have a battle-royal just for some fun. I mean that’s what my peers and I always did back in the seventies as it was always fun comparing whose system sounded better or what components were the best.

Typically the comments about my AR-3as were things like, “Frank, take that woolen blanket off of your speakers, will ya”, or in retaliation, “Why do your JBLs sound so bright and metallic, they’re hurting my ears”. Or “Your shitty cartridge is shaving your records down to hell”.

Or “Your Empire 598 turntable looks like an early printing press”.

Or, “You’re still listening to tubes?”

And another thing Alice! Today I turned 65 freaking years old and with silliness running rampant through out my brain, I stopped and realized that my AR speakers, the whole damn lot of them (20 wood boxes in number) have been the only thing that has hung out so long in my life since I was 22 years young. Family is gone, wives, lovers, a career, cars, houses, apartments, shoes, etc. etc. But, yet these wooden sound boxes are still with me and so are my PL amps and my vinyl records.

Is that sad and pitiful or just a Hi-Fi phenom?

Must I search for and try to ‘get-a-life’, or is this retirement?

Should I start to plan which color tulip bulbs I want to plant in early spring, or is that late fall, or gee, should I change back to briefs instead of boxers underwear? Will I need new ‘long-johns’?

This week I’ve got to make a call to ‘Medicare’ and sign up too. Are you kidding me?

It can be said, so I guess, that my world has grown very small in comparison to what it once was, dagnabit!

So, this past weekend, as a personal birthday present, I went and bought a used 2009 truck so I can transport my speakers all at once wherever I go.

You know, once the big flood comes and washes away eastern central Jersey, I can now get to higher ground.

fm

P.S. I may not be the sharpest tool in the barn, but I certainly can call a spade, a spade!

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Really old-time AR guys like me used to solder doughnut-hole washers to the end of our speaker wires, and slip the washers over the posts. Then as long as the knurled nuts were on even reasonably tight, the wire would never "jump" off the terminal. I never, ever had a problem.

The usual routine of twisting the wire into a "J" shape to slip over the post was pretty iffy--as you've discovered first-hand.

Just a thought. It worked well 45 years ago and that's my recommendation if you want to keep everything original.

Steve F.

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Really old-time AR guys like me used to solder doughnut-hole washers to the end of our speaker wires, and slip the washers over the posts. Then as long as the knurled nuts were on even reasonably tight, the wire would never "jump" off the terminal. I never, ever had a problem.

The usual routine of twisting the wire into a "J" shape to slip over the post was pretty iffy--as you've discovered first-hand.

Just a thought. It worked well 45 years ago and that's my recommendation if you want to keep everything original.

Steve F.

Like that one, Steve. Give us a photo...

Roger

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Most will agree that a solid wire-to-speaker connection is essential for optimization, but count me in among those who do not feel the need for expensive or exotic products to satisfactorily accomplish this link between components. Am still trying to locate the pics of my simple-yet-robust solution, but it is only one step more advanced than Steve's doughnut washers, which I'm sure worked just fine and are a huge structural improvement over the twisted strand "J" shape, which I also lived with for many years.

Meanwhile, a big fat Happy (milestone) Birthday to Frank-ola.

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Today I turned 65 freaking years old and with silliness running rampant through out my brain, I stopped and realized that my AR speakers, the whole damn lot of them (20 wood boxes in number) have been the only thing that has hung out so long in my life since I was 22 years young. Family is gone, wives, lovers, a career, cars, houses, apartments, shoes, etc. etc. But, yet these wooden sound boxes are still with me and so are my PL amps and my vinyl records.

Is that sad and pitiful or just a Hi-Fi phenom?

Must I search for and try to ‘get-a-life’, or is this retirement?

Happy Birthday Frank

You should be happy as you have not lost your child like enthusiasm to Hifi. Things like how to earn money and how to use money such a way that money you have is enough or figuring if you are behaving as you are supposed to be is basically quite boring. When I met my wife in 1990 I was considered as adult at 30 and she was 18 years old. I shared my passion to HiFi and music with couple of friends, otherwise there was not too much in my life as friendships were not too intimate anymore . When this girl at 18 could laugh at the comics or hifi with me, this really turned me alive. You have your enthusiasm and friends here...this is good start, but maybe friends on line are not enough?

Re spades. I have used forks or plugs and avoided ring type connectors in speaker leads to avoid possible accidents. Leads with ring connectors might break terminals or even tip speakers down when accident happens. Same is true to forks and plugs, but there is chance that they will break loose before the worst will happen. Sturdier connectors do not necessarily mean better sound quality, but may be nicer to use at least in some occasions.

Best Regards

Kimmo

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And another thing Alice! Today I turned 65 freaking years old ......

Yeah, yeah. Get over it and join the club! :lol: I've still got ya beat.

As far as the terminals, inexpensive ring Sta-Kons work perfectly. In a situation where I may want to change the speakers from time to time I like hook connectors, although they are a bit harder to find.

-Kent

post-101828-0-03326400-1412773441_thumb.

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Happy Birthday Frank

... . When this girl at 18 could laugh at the comics or hifi with me, this really turned me alive. You have your enthusiasm and friends here...this is good start, but maybe friends on line are not enough?

Re spades. I have used forks or plugs and avoided ring type connectors in speaker leads to avoid possible accidents. Leads with ring connectors might break terminals or even tip speakers down when accident happens. Same is true to forks and plugs, but there is chance that they will break loose before the worst will happen. Sturdier connectors do not necessarily mean better sound quality, but may be nicer to use at least in some occasions.

Best Regards

Kimmo

Yeah, touché Frank, and happy birthday!

I was thinking rings/banana pigtails would work nicely and not outrageously expensive. They would easily separate to avoid accidents.

Roger

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I was thinking rings/banana pigtails would work nicely and not outrageously expensive. They would easily separate to avoid accidents.

Roger

That's what I did and they work great and your right, not very expensive.

Here's a pic of them.

banana_zpsc637850a.jpg

John

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This is the pic I was looking for - - similar to the hardware store rings Roy showed in post #10, but with a soldered, rather than crimped, connection to the speaker wire. A small piece of heat shrink cleans it all up.

I also kind of like those Sta-Kons that JKent showed in post #12- - - never seen them before - - - sort of like a spade, but with a better resistance to pull-out from in-line tension.

post-112624-0-43051800-1412788751_thumb.

Edit: I meant to ask the OP about his statement, "Those AR posts drive me nuts." I've never encountered any problems with the simple screw posts on the old classic AR's (....OK, maybe I have dropped a stray washer or knurled nut once or twice), and while they may not be the deluxe 5-way binding posts that so many prefer, at least they are not the spring loaded terminals that showed up in later models. These are the type that drive me nuts.

post-112624-0-45064100-1412789928_thumb.

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This is the pic I was looking for - - similar to the hardware store rings Roy showed in post #10, but with a soldered, rather than crimped, connection to the speaker wire. A small piece of heat shrink cleans it all up.

I also kind of like those Sta-Kons that JKent showed in post #12- - - never seen them before - - - sort of like a spade, but with a better resistance to pull-out from in-line tension.

attachicon.gifspeaker wire teminals.jpg

Edit: I meant to ask the OP about his statement, "Those AR posts drive me nuts." I've never encountered any problems with the simple screw posts on the old classic AR's (....OK, maybe I have dropped a stray washer or knurled nut once or twice), and while they may not be the deluxe 5-way binding posts that so many prefer, at least they are not the spring loaded terminals that showed up in later models. These are the type that drive me nuts.

attachicon.gifspring terminal.jpg

I am an old mil-spec nut from way back. Years ago I designed a mil-spec wiring system (based on aircraft-wiring specifications) for Hatteras Yacht Company that used Thomas & Betts "Sta-Kon" solderless terminals and connectors. These connectors were designed to withstand constant vibration and stress, but the system is so good that I have used it for years with all of my high-fidelity connections, especially the "classic" series of AR speakers. Mil-spec T&B Sta-Kon terminals and tools are expensive, but good crimping tools and good-quality ring or spade terminals will pay off in the long run with "0" problems with connectivity. The "standard" of all mil-spec crimping tools for 16-14 ga and 12-10 ga solderless terminals is the venerable old T&B WT-145A (but there are many other tools of nearly equal quality). A new WT-145A will cost several hundred dollars ($650+), but used ones are readily available on eBay for a fraction of the cost!

--Tom Tyson

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post-100160-0-10789500-1413169565_thumb.

post-100160-0-89367900-1413169565_thumb.

post-100160-0-59837700-1413169566_thumb.

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This is the pic I was looking for - - similar to the hardware store rings Roy showed in post #10, but with a soldered, rather than crimped, connection to the speaker wire. A small piece of heat shrink cleans it all up.

I also kind of like those Sta-Kons that JKent showed in post #12- - - never seen them before - - - sort of like a spade, but with a better resistance to pull-out from in-line tension.

attachicon.gifspeaker wire teminals.jpg

Edit: I meant to ask the OP about his statement, "Those AR posts drive me nuts." I've never encountered any problems with the simple screw posts on the old classic AR's (....OK, maybe I have dropped a stray washer or knurled nut once or twice), and while they may not be the deluxe 5-way binding posts that so many prefer, at least they are not the spring loaded terminals that showed up in later models. These are the type that drive me nuts.

attachicon.gifspring terminal.jpg

Driving me nuts had a little pun intended, but they really do at times make things difficult. I guess when I try to use larger gauge wire/cable it likes to spin right out out the post when tightening. It seems the posts are not real long and run out of thread too. Now I am being a little critical here but with the amount I like to change speakers, trying to get a good bind can get tiresome.

Some good ideas above. How many of you are are running out to get some of Toms tools mentioned above? :D

I think at the end of the day, we all work really hard on setting up ourselves with great gear to provide the best sound we can get out of it. The last thing I want is to have the weak link in that chain being this little connection.

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How many of you are are running out to get some of Toms tools mentioned above? :D

I'm guessing several members. The price of that tool on e-pay seems to have escalated significantly since Tom's post :(

Maybe I'll get one "some day". The crimp tool I'm using is a real pain (literally!)

Kent

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Wow, that is one heavy-duty crimping tool! Great story, Tom.

Good point, David, about wanting to use the spade connectors if you are switching speakers often, and the ones you highlighted in post #1 should work just fine for that. As noted, I prefer the structural "grab" of the ring ends, but have more than once fumbled the knurled nut (and washer) when wiring up some speakers.

About the banana connectors, many people prefer them although I have never installed any in my old AR's. However several years ago, a designer who used to work for a/d/s gave me a pair of heavily modified 4x's where he added these posts and also removed the pot and filled the hole with a short carriage bolt. I think the solution that Roger and John proposed in post #14 allows for banana plugs without altering the original cabinet components.

post-112624-0-97286600-1413223721_thumb.

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Wow, that is one heavy-duty crimping tool! Great story, Tom.

Good point, David, about wanting to use the spade connectors if you are switching speakers often, and the ones you highlighted in post #1 should work just fine for that. As noted, I prefer the structural "grab" of the ring ends, but have more than once fumbled the knurled nut (and washer) when wiring up some speakers.

About the banana connectors, many people prefer them although I have never installed any in my old AR's. However several years ago, a designer who used to work for a/d/s gave me a pair of heavily modified 4x's where he added these posts and also removed the pot and filled the hole with a short carriage bolt. I think the solution that Roger and John proposed in post #14 allows for banana plugs without altering the original cabinet components.

attachicon.gif4x rear.jpg

Taking the solderless terminals one step further, the attached image is a simple drawing I made for a friend describing the hookup of his pair of AR-2ax speakers. Note that I show a T&B Sta-Kon-type solderless connector in my drawing, but any good ring (or spade) connector should work fine. These speaker connectors can also be soldered in lieu of crimping, simply because there is not a vibration issue. For aircraft and marine wiring, crimping is usually preferred, since the crimped connector is not as brittle as a soldered connection and are less likely to break in two due to fatigue stress.

—Tom Tyson

post-100160-0-22177300-1413327409_thumb.

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Nice drawing Tom.

Dave, for your short pigtails use whatever wire you like. I'd say 18 ga or better. Roy and others (including me) use marine-grade 18 ga wire for internal wiring. It's tinned and similar to what AR used originally. You could use that or short lengths of speaker wire. Color-coded is nice. But there's no need to go nuts. Make them so they LOOK nice, so you can say "I made those" but don't obsess about what wire is "best."

The one thing I'd probably avoid is "CCA" or "copper-clad aluminum". Better to stick with solid copper, and tinned is nice.

YMMV ;)

Kent

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I picked up some pieces to make some of those pigtails yesterday. What wire to use?

I was thinking 12 AWG silver plated copper stranded but the previous photo looks like test lead wire which should also work well and be more flexible.

Roger

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