9 replies to this topic

[redpackman]

I am the proud owner of two AR 2x speakers. That's what they're identified as on the back. Most of the paper work is weathered but there. I got these speakers used sometime in the 1970's and they've served me well for some decades.  I got the foam surrounds fixed a few years ago and noticed at the time a difference between the woofers. 

 

The midrange/tweeters are the same on these, being the 3.5 inch mesh over a pad speaker used as a mid in the AR 2ax. 

 

The speakers are separated in serial numbers by around 3000 digits with one being in the 8000 range and the other in the 11,000 range.   That fact alone may be the explanation for my puzzlement.

 

The first two pictures I will attempt to post are of one woofer and the second two are of the OTHER woofer in the second speaker. You will notice a significant difference between them. The second one is what I've been led to believe is the standard/ original design for a woofer in the early 2x / 2ax etc series.  The first speaker is different. Is it simply a throw-in speaker somebody put in the 2x after blowing the original? Is it a genuine AR speaker but a later revision? 

 

As an aside, it is interesting to note that these old 10" AR woofers were not meant to win any beauty contests, were they?  The sure sounded good though. Also any dark spots on the front of the speaker are not tears, but rather just spurious black goo accumulated sometime in the manufacturing process.

 

Any help would be appreciated.

 

I'll also throw in a picture of the cross over just for documentation. The cross-overs in both speakers are identical. I'm assuming the cap in this is shot by now (though the tweeters do work) and should be replaced by a newer film cap. Any comments on that would be appreciated too.

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[JKent]

Hi Red

Yes, the caps are probably shot (or at least drifted) and would benefit by being replaced with 6uF film caps. Just cut the green and blue wires and install something like this: http://www.madisound...li-mylar-6-mfd/

You don't even have to remove the old cap, although it will probably pry out easily. You should also clean or replace the pots.

Your first woofer looks just like one in my 2ax serial # 190942 and 191646, that I sold to a CSP member about 3 years ago.

The woofer in the other one looks to me like an earlier cloth-surround woofer. It looks like the woofers in my other 2ax's (also since sold), SN 41070 & 40214. It would probably benefit from a coat of Roy's sealing glop. Also, it looks to me like the dust cap is missing from that woofer. Probably a good idea to replace it. If you PM Roy to ask about buying some sealant he "may" also have one of the correct dust caps.

Kent

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[redpackman]

Thank you, JKent for the info.

 

It seems I have two different production runs for my AR-2x's, early and late.  

 

BTW I have also gone on eBay and looked at the different woofers that have come out of the AR-2ax systems. It seems that both types of speaker are represented there. I didn't see any for the AR-2X which didn't surprise me because there are so many fewer of them than the 2ax. But I have been told that the AR-2ax used the same woofer(s) as the AR-2x

[JKent]

I have been told that the AR-2ax used the same woofer(s) as the AR-2x

Yes, but...

The 2ax used 2 different woofers and they are not interchangeable. You seem to have 1 of each. You cannot swap woofers in those 2 cabinets.

btw--cloth surrounds should never need replacement, but that's water over the dam at this point.

Kent

[redpackman]

What made them non-interchangable? The fit in the cabinet? 

 

I presume one was for the earlier AR-2AX and the other for a later edition with the same model number?

[JKent]

Now that I look at my photos, I may be mistaken about that. I may be thinking of the old and new versions of the AR-3a woofers. Do yours look like the cutouts in both cabinets match?

Kent

[HarryM]

You are right Kent, the early 10" are 6 hole and the later are 4 hole. The first speaker may be a second run of the early version. Even the basket is different.

[RoyC]

The AR-2x always used the same woofer as the AR-2ax, and there were 4 basic versions of the AR-2ax woofer.

 

Red's photos show the first 2 versions. The cloth surround woofer (also used in the AR-2 and 2a) came first, and the second is the somewhat rare early foam surround woofer with a 6 hole, wide flange basket. The mounting diameters of these two frames are the same.  Both woofers were used with the same crossover, so it is likely the response is not too different between them. (Red, the marks on the cones were deliberate, and had something to do with testing and response contouring.)

 

The third version was much the same as the second, having a foam surround and alnico magnet...but it had the smaller, more conventional size basket. The 4th version was the same as the 3rd with a ceramic magnet. There are many of these woofers still around, but they will not fit earlier cabinets (like Red's) without an adapter ring. It should  be noted that these smaller framed woofers were mounted using 4 holes, yet some have 6 holes in the frame.

 

Red,

You are good to go with the woofers you have. If you want the woofers to match, the cloth surround woofers are much easier to find than your early foam surround version. (I have a number of extra cloth surround woofers. If you decide  to go that route send me a PM.)

 

Roy

[redpackman]

Thank you for all the information. Yes, the speakers fit seems to be interchangable. And I know too that the 3a's woofer was a cloth surround as I have a pair of 3a's as well and appreciate its sound a great deal. 

 

I'm relieved to find that both of my speakers are indeed AR speakers and that one of them is not a knock off that was thrown in just to fill a hole no matter WHAT it sounds like. 

 

I also have a pair of Harman Kardon HK-40 speakers and the HK-40 woofer, though different sized than these (smaller, I believe) is constructed remarkably like the first speaker I pictured. Did AR "make" their own speakers, or did they contract it out to reputable manufacturers of the era? 

[RoyC]

AR made many drivers in those days. CTS also manufactured drivers to AR's specifications...as well as drivers for lots of other companies.

 

The earlier AR-3/AR-3a cloth surround, alnico magnet woofer was changed to a ceramic magnet version with a foam surround in 1970. Around 70,000 of the 100,000+  AR-3a's manufactured were equipped with the foam surround woofer. AR manufactured the large 3a type woofer for decades.

 

Roy